An Israeli soldier has been killed and three others injured in a bomb attack on their patrol near the border with Gaza

I think we are getting closer and closer to yet another round of violance:

"This is a severe terrorist attack. It cannot be accepted, and we will respond," Israeli defence minister Ehud Barak was quoted as saying by a military spokesman.

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The question is what would you have done, if being in his shoes - and is not an easy question.
I don't think he is talking out of anger - I think he is reflecting public opinion (elections coming up) - public opinion is coming out of anger - that is for sure.
We've seen it happen before for other nations - problem is it took a long time... 400 years for the Irish i think? Not sure ...
But, I want to say I'm optimistic and it will take us less than 400, thanks to WWW, thechnology and people like you.
When do you condemn the actions of Hamas in the killing and maiming of these people? You accuse me of brow beating a subject yet you only bemoan the death and maiming of Palestinians. It is like you celebrate the death of Jews and then deny the Israeli right to justice.

I just find it interesting
Right..Violence begets violence.

So are you criticizing both the violence that was..and that which is being threatened..or just the threat (excuse)

Do we have any pity for the cease fire- still unborn
Do we mourn its premature death
Do we only wag our finger at Israel..even before it has reacted..
Do we care that this is an act of violence..crossing the border to attack Israel on its soil..probably to provoke it in order to achieve gain (what gain do you think..peace or disruption of possible negotiations?)

Do we give a shit if the Palestinians have a chance to get their act together, reconciliation between hamas and Fatah through Egypts efforts..and that this will efforts will be shot down by breaking the relative quiet?

Ruach, are the Palestinians so weak and nothing in your mind that they are not an there no call for any responsibility to help preserve an atmosphere so Mitchell can come and move things forward?

Tell you think Hamas and Jihad are interested in Mitchell's success?

Hey, myron, cool doesn't make any difference anyway, does it?

Sorry Ruach--just i'm getting uptight before the next round of needless suffering.
I criticize the threat too.

Israeli land is not more sacred then Gazan land for the Palestinians..the ceasefire is the victim now..The cease far is not sacred..but it is the road to the Sacred.

I am sad about the violence because it will breed more violence...not because of any israeli hurt

My meaning of "Palestinians getting their act together" is not solving the problem of the people of Gaza..this is a huge mission. Getting their act togehter means that Gaza and the West Bank leadership can not be at each others throat. it means that the welfare of their people is dependent on the different factions working together, constructively. If people care about Palestine..they must care about this split that has isolated them from other Moslem and Arab countries of the region- not only from the USA.. (I agree that overtures to the Hamas are important..and Obama will I imagine do it.. but Egypt's frustration with Hamas must be significant, don't you think?)

So you "Hope that the Hamas will cooperate"..Now that is real activism!

I understand anger..but i am afraid that the bomb today was not out of anger dear Ruach. It was so calculated with cameras ready to roll..We are familiar with this method over the years. It was part of organized armed struggle, that Hamas continues to believe in..and activate.

Most violence here is not out of anger..both Israel and Palestinian leaders use violence very consciously and cynically. (this is a difference that some Palestinians think differentiate between the first intifada and the second..The first being more of a popular uprising..that is why they see the first as being leading to recognition of the the need for two state solution..and the second being closer to another naqba)

I join you in your criticism..i only ask that you go one step further..I do not ask for sympathy or empathy..i do not ask you to support israel's acts or policy.- i ask you to have mercy on the future.

.I only ask that you realize that moving ahead requires changes on the side of some Palestinian leadership..the elected Hamas leadership who has not been willing to accept previous Palestinian positions that negotiating with Israel is the way to a solution.

Does this sound that outlandish?

I sometimes wonder why the Israeli public thinks that it can not count on the nations of the world. Why this paranoia? (Now, thank G-d, Egypt, Europe and other countries know that it is in their interests and the Palestinian interest for Hamas to become a responsible player on the field.) But when i come to Ipeace and only hear the constant monotonous tone over and over again..condemn...condemn...condemn.."All Palestine is for the Palestinians" i begin to understand the feeling.

I can agree with all you write..with all the notes you play, some are painful..many of them are true. I am willing to forgo debating others..however you are missing the needed notes that will make this a rhythm that will flow forwards.
You live in a Jewish settlement in Cis-Jordania ...
Durinmg Your mili service how many did u kill ???
Dear Carlos

I thank G-d i have never had to face an enemy..I was lucky to be in bed when two terrorists infiltrated my Kibbutz and wanted to kill high school kids...They were killed before succeeding in their mission.

I am thankful that my contact with Palestinians is decent...that i see them at work..and participating in Weddings in our synagogue..

i am thankful for their company when i pick them up..if they missed their "taxi" ride to Israel where they are employed. I wait for them at the checkpoint when the must leave the car to show their paper.Yes, they are checked..inhumane, right? Of course i know that there checkpoints are a place where there is unnecessary harassment as well..)

Today Samih called me ..He needed a ride home..can he meet me in Beit Shemesh and we will return to Cis-Jordan (west bank) together.

He is living under occupation..It could be worse and has been. But things have improved. It could be better..and has been. Occupation is not good.. Not for him and not for me.

Dr. Amro, the Palestinian dentist who opened a clinic in the stone building on the next hill..He is not afraid of his Settler patients..He is a man of peace. They are not afraid to give him "their mouths". Not everybody in our area liked the idea of this Hebron citizen moving into our the middle of a settlement bloc..So they passed out papers of protest. It didn't help them.

There are settlers who do damage..their are those who have killed. I am disgusted by it. I don't care how small a minority they is disgusting. The daily problems the Palestinians feel bother me as well, problems of water, mobility, etc.

But the real demons are in our our souls. And these demons know no borders..they may even be in Venezuela. (Watch out!) Thank G-d when i meet my neighbors, and they meet me...we can see each other..and not demons.
Acknoledging Your honesty...i like You convinced that hate and injustice results from "massification" - on the individual level everybody is a good neighbour as long as You treat him like You want to be treated.
Carlos, I should ask you for an apology for your previous post...I should ignore your reply, even though it is very civil.

I just want to point out that i believe most injustice that Israel perpetrates in the Middle East has little to do with "hate".

"Massification"...breed blindness to human suffering. It allows us to easily rationalize all sorts of egoistic and nationalistic goals. It allows us to point wagging fingers at "them", as if they all deserve the fate we force upon them. It allows a sort of "demonization".."you can not trust them", etc The terrible, deep emotion of Hate is not really present.

This makes me optimistic.. If Mitchell could get things done in Ireland, where there was, i believe, an amount of hate and deep negative emotions..he may stand a better chance here. (although here the territorial instinct is at play on both sides..but it is Israel that needs to seriously take action on redefining its stand), are some internal struggles, especially on the Palestinian side, that will prove to be huge obstacles.
You are probably one of the kibbuzim of od socialist style...
Unfortunatlely current israeli government did not make it easy for Mitchell - embarassing him with further agressions ... nevertheless i am sure he will move more than recent 8 years
did you read the news about the off-shore gas fields ... theoretical in controll of Palestine Authority, but in fact due to the sea blockade not to be exploited
Several people see this as the real economic cause of the recent war...
the work out a peace accord is - economically spoken - almost ever a win-win situation for all partners (workforce, development etc)
Really there are so many worse conflicts in the world (Darfur, Aids...)that Yours should end - also an example for the world - that it is possible and for the best interest of everybody
One condition is politic change in Knesset .... the ability to speak with each other, than to shoot
Mate, I don't who who are you getting your info from ...

First, embaracing Mitchell? Too bad, but as you can see the militants in Gaza are not boyscouts.

Regarding the gas finding and accusations, this is the best example:
1. the gas was found in the north (Gaza is in the south)
2. Palestinian Authority (not even talking about Hamas) does not control any waters - this may happen in the future if they agree to a peace process, and for that they will have to stop stating the destruction of Israel in their books and ceremonies.
3. Most importantly - the gas was found not by the government but by private companies investing lots of money in the drills !!!

Also, there is no relation between what happens in the Knesset and the situation in Gaza.

You are welcome to ask before accusing, I'll try to do my best to answer any of your questions - it will be easier to answer questions that to answer accusitions.



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